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BUSH It's tough right now, but they're headed to elections. The people want to vote. If the United States is willing to lead and never waver in our belief that liberty can change the habits of people, never blink, be kind and compassionate, generous with our money--which we are--but resolute in our belief in liberty, Iraq will end up being a free country. It doesn't have to look like America, by the way. That's one of the great myths--that all of a sudden, these countries must look like America. Quite the contrary. They will develop their own style of freedom to meet their own customs. And by the way, when I've talked to people about the march to freedom, I remind them of the Articles of Confederation. It was not exactly a smooth road to the government we know today. To me, there is a natural progression if people even get a whiff of liberty. And that's what you're seeing. I think a free Iraq is going to influence Iran. There are people inside that country who are anxious for a free society to emerge. As you know, I'm the first President ever to have articulated a position that there ought to be a Palestinian state. I believe that a Palestinian state will emerge. I know a free Iraq will serve as an example to the Palestinian people that it's possible to live in a society where, actually, the government is responsive, as opposed to a society where one person has pretty much decided the fate of the people.
TIME You mean Yasser Arafat.
BUSH A failed leader. I was the first world leader ever to have suggested that, I guess, publicly, much to the consternation of many of our allies. Nevertheless, they're now beginning to realize that maybe I was right, that if the person doesn't have it in his soul to believe in liberty, a free society will never emerge. And Mr. Arafat has had his chance. I view these moments as transforming events. We'll look back and we'll say, you know, Thank God the United States held true to its belief.
You know, I sit down with the families of the fallen and tell them the reason why the sacrifice will be worth it in the long run. It may seem such a distant memory for many, but it wasn't all that long ago that we were fighting Japan. My dad fought against Japan. And now [Japanese Prime Minister Junichiro] Koizumi is one of the best allies in peace. This wouldn't have happened had my predecessors not believed that liberty could transform an enemy into an ally. The same in Germany, in many ways.
TIME Is the war on terrorism something our generation and the next generation are just going to have to get used to?
BUSH Yes, I think it is a long-lasting ideological struggle. Frankly, the war on terror is somewhat misnamed, though. It ought to be called the struggle of a totalitarian point of view that uses terror as a tool to intimidate the free.
TIME In a recent article, Norman Podhoretz calls it World War IV and says it's going to last a long time.
BUSH I'm not the historian. I'm the guy making history. I deal with problems as I see them, and I think long range as well. I do think it's a long-term issue. It's one in which liberty will prevail if we have the will and the determination.
TIME Are you thinking it's a 30-year, 40-year problem?