(2 of 3)
A. In the referendum last year, the right wing polled no less than 800,000 votes. In addition, they have got a substantial section of the civil service, the police force, the army, which support them. Now they have said if the A.N.C. wins the elections and establishes the government, they will take up arms. That is the threat facing us. It's a serious threat, but we aren't overly concerned. We have to reorganize the police force and make sure it is capable of defending democracy.
Q. Can you think of any precedent for a minority that has held power for centuries and surrendered it peacefully?
A. We are now making joint decisions with that minority. They said they would never talk with the A.N.C., and they fought almost every election on that basis. We have made them sit down and talk to us. We are now together planning the future South Africa. They have had to unban the A.N.C., to lift the state of emergency, to allow a climate of free political activity, which they had not allowed for more than 40 years. They have released political prisoners, allowed political exiles to return to the country, amended and even repealed repressive legislation, and agreed on the installation of a transitional executive council. And now they are agreeing with us on a date for an election in the country.
Q. Why have they cooperated?
A. I think they realized that not only were the overwhelming majority of South Africans prepared to fight for the right to run their lives, but the whole international community was against South Africa.
Q. So, did sanctions work?
A. Oh, there is no doubt.
Q. Should sanctions now be lifted?
A. We have come to the verge of calling them off. Our official policy was that until free and fair elections were held, we would maintain sanctions. But the problems facing our country -- 7 million people unemployed, rocketing crime, the violence and so on -- has made us revise our time frame. If the transitional executive council is installed and if an election date is set, we would call off sanctions.
Q. Three and a half years ago, you were still under arrest. Now you're engaged in the process of rebuilding the country. Did you ever think this was going to happen in your lifetime?
A. There were definitely moments when I was not so certain this day would come. But as you know, I did send a message that was read by my daughter at a public meeting attended by Archbishop Tutu where I said, "I will return." So that perception was always there. But that doesn't mean there were not moments when I doubted whether this moment would come. But the strength of the struggle in the country and the support of the international community has always been powerful, and that kept our morale very high, and it made us feel that the forces of change were too powerful to be ignored by the government.
Q. Many have commented about your lack of bitterness. How could you put the past behind you?