Director's Cut

MIRAMAX
Scorsese directs DiCaprio on the Gangs set, built at Rome's Cinecittà studio

By now, Martin Scorsese is used to two things: being called America's finest picturemaker, and getting stiffed at the Oscars ceremony. This Sunday he will find out if he wins for Gangs of New York. This year, at the urging of Miramax Films' Harvey Weinstein, he has campaigned more aggressively for the prize. But some have found the Gangs gang too aggressive; one ad, which reprinted an Op-Ed column by former Academy president Robert Wise, caused such an uproar among other members it was hastily pulled. How much does an Oscar mean to a man with big projects but no smash hit on his resume? While scouting locations for his next film, The Aviator, the director took time for a chat about the vagaries of awards and joys of filmmaking.

Does it feel as if you've been campaigning for Gangs of New York for 32 years now?

Actually longer. The first story I ever heard about the Nativists coming down the street to attack the church was when I was 8 years old. And that sort of stayed in my head. So it feels like 50 years of campaigning.

Is this the first time you've been involved in naked Oscar campaigning?

Yeah, naked Oscar; you're right. You know, the last time I was nominated was for Goodfellas [in 1991]. so I'd lost track of what it's like. but i must say that from when we did the campaigning on Goodfellas, it's gotten a lot more intense. And there are all these other award ceremonies. And so much airtime to fill up. If one of the actors from your film is not talking on that screen in the middle of the night, there will be five other actors from five different films talking. But if it had to be a film, it's good that it was this one. Because I put so much into it, and it was the biggest budget i've ever had. And the biggest risk I've ever taken.

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You've been on talk shows.

Every talk show, you name it. You name it. I'm sorry.

Do you enjoy this attention?

Not necessarily. But you know, I'm fighting for my life, what can I tell you? Not the Oscar I'm talking about how much money the picture makes. And whether it's perceived as a hit or not. And I'm just going to keep doing it until enough people have seen the picture.

Back in the '70s, when George Lucas and Francis Ford Coppola and Steven Spielberg were creating huge box-office successes, you said, "I know I'll never have a hit like that."

Yeah, I realized I was never going to make a blockbuster like The Godfather or Jaws or Star Wars. And I don't think I ever will.

You seem to know the popular limitations of the films that you wanted to make.

Yeah, that's been the struggle. And this one, it cost much more. But I did all these movies without the Oscar. If they give it, fine. They should vote if they think it's well directed. They shouldn't vote for any other reason.

Do you want it more than you did back in 1981 with Raging Bull?

You know, I never thought I'd get it then either. Particularly when I wasn't even nominated for Taxi Driver. And certainly when I didn't get it on Raging Bull. I just said, fine, I got to make the picture. And that's the rationale that has kept me going. With Goodfellas it was a little bit hard on my parents, I MUST SAY. That hurt a little bit. They were there. but I keep thinking, it's a good thing I didn't, because I would have gotten a swollen head. I think I would have gotten in more personal trouble than I did in reality.

Harvey Weinstein said, "Marty would like to get one of those golden guys."

I think my friends, my family and Harvey want it more than I do. I've sort of come to terms with I'm not going to get it. You know what I'm saying? [Laughs.]

Twice now, you've lost to directors making their first feature film.

Yes.

And it could be Rob Marshall, who directed Chicago, this time.

That's who I think it's going to be.

There was a quote in the New York Observer recently from "a senior-level studio executive" who said about you, "I'm not sure what he's contributed ... He's an enormously talented guy ... But he doesn't care about making money for anybody."

Aha, but that means that the business is only around to make money. That's the only reason that people are in this. I don't agree with that.

You must have a huge ego to think that you're a successful director even though you've never made a movie that grossed $100 million domestic.

Well, I tell you, maybe I do. [Laughs.] I'm not the easiest person in the world to get along with. But I'm old. Maybe there's a few other executives who don't think like this guy who will give me some extra money to make a picture or two in the next 10 years, if I make it through. It's a different world now for me too, because I have a 3-year-old kid now, and everything is scary. I still want to keep pushing the envelope in terms of making my kind of movie within this system. financially i'm getting myself back on my feet because of Gangs. I have a family. There's one project I'm fighting to do, fighting to do. But it would take about a year and a half, and I can't do it next.